ATI TV Wonder Digital Cable Tuner: AMD and Dell Bring CableCARD to PCs
by Anand Lal Shimpi on April 3, 2007 11:37 AM EST- Posted in
- GPUs
The Installation: Day Two
The second day started off on a new foot. The same Time Warner tech from the day before showed up, but this time his supervisor was with him. The two brought new CableCARDs just in case the ones we tried earlier were somehow too old to work with the tuners. A third Time Warner employee also showed up, this one a regional digital engineer. A fourth Time Warner representative appeared during the course of the day, albeit due to a mistake in scheduling.
Testing levels at the outlet to make sure we had a good enough signal
The Time Warner trio joined us as we got both Microsoft and AMD on the phone trying to get to the bottom of our problems. There was a single OCUR test platform somewhere in the Raleigh area that had been activated and was currently in use on Time Warner's network, so we knew it was a solvable problem; it was just a matter of solving it. While yours truly went to work with AMD on tracing through the setup steps to make sure we didn't miss anything, Gary Lusk was on the phone with Microsoft and Dell making sure there wasn't anything else we could try. The three Time Warner folks also went to work; our peak number of concurrent telephone conversations was about 4 at this point (and that's not counting the one Time Warner rep who had two phones up to his head at once).
Two TWC techs
Two phones, one TWC tech
Everyone is on the phone
The first problem TWC fixed was with regards to our initial CableCARD installation. When a CableCARD is activated on TWC's network, the host id of the CableCARD is married to the device it is activated on. When we switched that CableCARD to one of the OCURs, TWC's system wouldn't let it on the network as it was married to two different devices. [Ed: So polygamy is out of the question?] The system should have automatically deleted the duplicate host id but it had to be manually done on Time Warner's end; after doing that, things started moving a lot smoother.
We were actually able to get some digital cable channels after Time Warner reset the CableCARDs on their end; however, we had trouble tuning to some channels and we'd randomly lose signal. Time Warner suspected that the wiring at our location might be a problem so they went to work on cleaning things up a bit. The cable signal coming in to the location was fed through a surge suppressor and then sent to an amp and two 8-way splitters. The techs removed the surge suppressor and replaced the amp with an amp of their own; this amp had a built in splitter that directly fed the coax inputs on the two TV Wonder DCTs.
Removing the surge suppressor and isolating the coax lines that went directly to the tuners helped a bit, and we could almost watch digital cable normally now. At the end of the entire ordeal, the senior TWC representative that was with us turned to us and asked us what this system could do. We explained, to which he responded with the most priceless of facial expressions. It was an expression that needed no explanation; his reaction asked the question "why on earth would you go through this when you can just rent an HD-DVR from us for $9 a month?"
There were still some lingering issues which we will get to shortly, but as far as Time Warner was concerned, the installation was complete. Dell and TWC left, leaving us to spend some quality time with the system.
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n7 - Wednesday, April 4, 2007 - link
I am amazed at how restricted this is.I was looking forward to the day when i could get a tuner capable of high def support to add to my PC.
And now i see that the once again, the consumers are basically getting royally ******.
I'm incredibly disapppointed.
Thanx very much for this article though...does an excellent job of showing just how retarded DRM has become...
Cygni - Tuesday, April 3, 2007 - link
Thank you for this article Anand. When you first reviewed Vista, i asked for a review of its MCE component, to which you replied such an article was comming. I was beginning to think you forgot about writing that article! :DI am in the shrinking majority of non HDTV owners. I have a 32in Sony CRT TV that ive had for at least 10 years. Its still one of the best looking TV's around, in my opinion. I use MCE to function as a recorder so that I dont have to pay a monthly fee to anyone. I feel thats ridiculous. I bought a $50 ATI TV card and with MCE, can do everything a TIVO can, AND save money, AND burn what programing i want and give it to who i want.
I have one big question i wanted to ask, however. Did you try Vista Media Centers multi screen performance? I use Svideo to connect my TV and computer, and i enjoy working on one screen while having MCE going in the other. However, MCE 2k5's performance in this situation is pretty bad, and the MCE team itself admitted that they hadnt thought of this scenario.
feraltoad - Tuesday, April 3, 2007 - link
So let me get this straight the ONLY people that really want OCUR (people with media center PCs) will be the ones that can't get it? WTH! Bad enough you need HDCP monitors and Video cards, but even when you do upgrade everything it still won't be enough until you buy a ready made box (and if you have a HTPC that is used as a Media PC then it is probably DIY). So the people that this things is going to marketed to will be people that 1)Have no idea it exists 2)Don't/Won't want it 3)Apparently will be better served to pay $10 a month to rent something that will "just work". I have a MCE2005 pc, and it looks pretty obvious which way the wind is blowing: HD-DVR here I come.Also, besides a rant I had a question. What if you have ONE HDCP compliant monitor(HDTV) and one non HDCP LCD (that doesn't merit replacement yet). Will it still work and let you play the content on the TV? Or will the non hdcp monitor "break" the compliance and thus the functionality.
thestain - Wednesday, April 4, 2007 - link
AMD's kissing Microsofts rear is a recipe for an american made disaster.Is there no hardware company that is willing to give customers ownership of the hardware they buy anymore??
AMD/Daamit would do better getting the cpus and gpus out that have been delayed and delayed.. or nVidia and Intel will destroy AMD.
Wolfpup - Tuesday, April 3, 2007 - link
That wasn't mentioned in the article. In two years I'll have to get some sort of ATSC replacement for my NTSC-only S2 Tivo.Also-is this for real that you can't burn real DVDs with this setup? I presume that means you can't even copy files to another computer to watch (only stream them to a 360)?
In that case this doesn't work for me. Hope there are more ATSC solutions available by the time I need them...
Smilin - Tuesday, April 3, 2007 - link
Your #1 mistake was activating the card on a different device first. This caused you major problems. The mating of the card to a particular device is not a time-warner only thing. Had you not made this pretty dumb move you wouldn't have had Dell, ATI and Time Warner dancing around like monkeys for so many days.The problem switching between SD and HD is most likely a server issue at the cable company. Unfortunately "that guy" who is smart enough to fix it is so far up the food chain you'll never reach him through the mass of standard techs.
How do I know this? Go check out the Support forums over at Tivo. The problems are everywhere. The series 3 has dual cable cards and guess what? Cable companies give it fits. In every case the cable company will push back and say it's a problem with your device. In every case this turns out not to be true.
I ran into many of the issues you are seeing with my Series 3 Tivo. After like 4 cable cards, 5 trips from techs, pulling my hair until I was bald I finally got "the guy" who said it was merely a server issue on their end. No problems since.
mwales - Tuesday, April 3, 2007 - link
So as a Kubuntu Linux user, on a PC built from parts, and "soon to be owner" of a PS3, I feel a little left out of the party. Seriously, the amount of restrictions for a system to do this is ridiculous and makes me want to vomit.I happen to have a Windows XP running Beyond TV DVR software (it's NTSC only unfortunately). But I'm able to share my media folder and access it from Windows PCs, Linux PCs, and even both XBox systems when they run XBox Media Center. It works FANTASTIC! Even my wife can stream content and watch it on an XBox without any issues or help. Once I get a Creative Vision M, I can easily move my non-DRM files unencumbered to my portable video player. I'm also able to burn DVDs of shows I really enjoyed so I can watch them later on my DVD/DivX player.
DigitalFreak - Tuesday, April 3, 2007 - link
As long as the content providers are allowed to dictate how and where we watch their content, these products will always be a pain in the ass to setup and use.Still waiting on the CES 2006 announced DirecTV / MCE tuners.
michal1980 - Tuesday, April 3, 2007 - link
i'd get that 4000 grand pc if it came with all the techs to help set it up.cable card needs bi-directional support before it gets my vote though.
BPB - Tuesday, April 3, 2007 - link
This article was not at all interesting for me personally. Oh, the tech end of it was, and the fact that AMD/MS/Hollywood/the cable industry can't work well as a group was interesting. But since the technology itself is not available to me unless I buy an expensicve Dell (or equivalent), I really don't care about it. I'll continue to go along using my Cox HD-DVR and be happy. Actually, if I do want to do something like this I'll simply rent a Cox HD cable box and plug it into my ATI 650 based tuner card (which has HD support) or my X1900 AIW (which accepts HD input). So for the price of the Cox rental I can have HD on my PC, and for far less money. Then again, the way MS and the cable industry are going, I can't be sure that would work. Oh well, guess I'll have to continue using the Firewire out on my HD-DVR to copy movies to my wife's notebook, then my desktop. It's a pain, but it's cheap and easy. My dad's new HD-DVR is also a cable modem. I wonder if it can be networked? Wouldn't that be nice?