ATI Radeon HD 4890 vs. NVIDIA GeForce GTX 275
by Anand Lal Shimpi & Derek Wilson on April 2, 2009 12:00 AM EST- Posted in
- GPUs
I'm not really sure why we have NDAs on these products anymore. Before we even got our Radeon HD 4890, before we were even briefed on it, NVIDIA contacted us and told us that if we were working on a review to wait. NVIDIA wanted to send us something special.
Then in the middle of our Radeon HD 4890 briefing what do we see but a reference to a GeForce GTX 275 in the slides. We hadn't even laid hands on the 275, but AMD knew what it was and where it was going to be priced.
If you asked NVIDIA what the Radeon HD 4890 was, you'd probably hear something like "an overclocked 4870". If you asked AMD what the GeForce GTX 275 was, you'd probably get "half of a GTX 295".
The truth of the matter is that neither one of these cards is particularly new, they are both a balance of processors, memory, and clock speeds at a new price point.
As the prices on the cards that already offered a very good value fell, higher end and dual GPU cards remained priced significantly higher. This created a gap in pricing between about $190 and $300. AMD and NVIDIA saw this as an opportunity to release cards that fell within this spectrum, and they are battling intensely over price. Both companies withheld final pricing information until the very last minute. In fact, when I started writing this intro (Wednesday morning) I still had no idea what the prices for these parts would actually be.
Now we know that both the Radeon HD 4890 and the GeForce GTX 275 will be priced at $250. This has historically been a pricing sweet spot, offering a very good balance of performance and cost before we start to see hugely diminishing returns on our investments. What we hope for here is a significant performance bump from the GTX 260 core 216 and Radeon HD 4870 1GB class of performance. We'll wait till we get to the benchmarks to reveal if that's what we actually get and whether we should just stick with what's good enough.
At a high level, here's what we're looking at:
| GTX 285 | GTX 275 | GTX 260 Core 216 | GTS 250 / 9800 GTX+ | |
| Stream Processors | 240 | 240 | 216 | 128 |
| Texture Address / Filtering | 80 / 80 | 80 / 80 | 72/72 | 64 / 64 |
| ROPs | 32 | 28 | 28 | 16 |
| Core Clock | 648MHz | 633MHz | 576MHz | 738MHz |
| Shader Clock | 1476MHz | 1404MHz | 1242MHz | 1836MHz |
| Memory Clock | 1242MHz | 1134MHz | 999MHz | 1100MHz |
| Memory Bus Width | 512-bit | 448-bit | 448-bit | 256-bit |
| Frame Buffer | 1GB | 896MB | 896MB | 512MB |
| Transistor Count | 1.4B | 1.4B | 1.4B | 754M |
| Manufacturing Process | TSMC 55nm | TSMC 55nm | TSMC 65nm | TSMC 55nm |
| Price Point | $360 | ~$250 | $205 | $140 |
| ATI Radeon HD 4890 | ATI Radeon HD 4870 | ATI Radeon HD 4850 | |
| Stream Processors | 800 | 800 | 800 |
| Texture Units | 40 | 40 | 40 |
| ROPs | 16 | 16 | 16 |
| Core Clock | 850MHz | 750MHz | 625MHz |
| Memory Clock | 975MHz (3900MHz data rate) GDDR5 | 900MHz (3600MHz data rate) GDDR5 | 993MHz (1986MHz data rate) GDDR3 |
| Memory Bus Width | 256-bit | 256-bit | 256-bit |
| Frame Buffer | 1GB | 1GB | 512MB |
| Transistor Count | 959M | 956M | 956M |
| Manufacturing Process | TSMC 55nm | TSMC 55nm | TSMC 55nm |
| Price Point | ~$250 | ~$200 | $150 |
We suspect that this will be quite an interesting battle and we might have some surprises on our hands. NVIDIA has been talking about their new drivers which will be released to the public early Thursday morning. These new drivers offer some performance improvements across the board as well as some cool new features. Because it's been a while since we talked about it, we will also explore PhysX and CUDA in a bit more depth than we usually do in GPU reviews.
We do want to bring up availability. This will be a hard launch for AMD but not for NVIDIA (though some European retailers should have the GTX 275 on sale this week). As for AMD, we've seen plenty of retail samples from AMD partners and we expect good availability starting today. If this ends up not being the case, we will certainly update the article to reflect that later. NVIDIA won't have availability until the middle of the month (we are hearing April 14th).
NVIDIA hasn't been hitting their launches as hard lately, and we've gotten on them about that in past reviews. This time, we're not going to be as hard on them for it. The fact of the matter is that they've got a competitive part coming out in a time frame that is very near the launch of an AMD part at the same price point. We are very interested in not getting back to the "old days" where we had paper launched parts that only ended up being seen in the pages of hardware review sites, but we certainly understand the need for companies to get their side of the story out there when launches are sufficiently close to one another. And we're certainly not going to fault anyone for that. Not being available for purchase is it's own problem.
From the summer of 2008 to today we've seen one of most heated and exciting battles in the history of the GPU. NVIDIA and AMD have been pushing back and forth with differing features, good baseline performance with strengths in different areas, and incredible pricing battles in the most popular market segments. While AMD and NVIDIA fight with all their strength to win customers, the real beneficiary has consistently been the end user. And we certainly feel this launch is no exception. If you've got $250 to spend on graphics and were wondering whether you should save up for the GTX 285 or save money and grab a sub-$200 part, your worries are over. There is now a card for you. And it is good.
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papapapapapapapababy - Thursday, April 2, 2009 - link
Is the quality of the drivers. ATI. Call me when: A) you fix your broken drivers. B) Decide to finally ditch that bloated Microsoft Visual C++ just so i can have the enormous privilege of using your- also terrible and also bloated- CCC panel. c) Stop pouting my pc with your useless extra services. Until then 'll carry on with NVIDIA. Thanks. > Happy- nvidia- user (and frustrated ex-ATI costumer)josh6079 - Thursday, April 2, 2009 - link
The quality of drivers can be argued either way and the negative connotations associated with "Drivers" and "ATi" are all but ancient concerns in the single GPU arena.papapapapapapapababy - Thursday, April 2, 2009 - link
BS. I have a pretty beefy pc, that doesn't mean im going to stop demanding for efficiency when it comes to memory usage and to reduce the shear amount of stupid services required to run a simple application. This are all FACTS about Ati. But hey, you are free to use vista, buy ATI and end up with a system that is inferior and slower than mine.( performance and feature wise)btw, to all the people claiming that cuda and physics are gimmicks... Give me a fn break! U Hypocrites. This cards ARE HUGE GIMMICKS! BEHOLD he MEGA POWAAR! For what? Crysis? Thats just ONE GAME. ONE. UNO. 1. Then what?... Console ports. At the end of the day 99.9% of games today are console ports. The fact is, you don't need this monstrosities in order to run that console crap. Trust me, you may get a boner comparing 600 fps vs 599, but the rest of the - sane- people here, dsnt give a rat ass, expectantly when the original - console game- barely runs at 30fps to begin with.
SiliconDoc - Monday, April 6, 2009 - link
The red roosters cannot face reality my friend. They are insane as you point out.cuda, physx, badaboom, the vreveal, the mirrors edge that addicted anand, none of it matters to red roosters - the excessive heat at idle from ati - also thrown out with the bathwater, endless driver issues, forget it - no forced multi gpu - nmevermind, no gamer profiles built into the driver for 100 popular games that nvidia has - forget it - better folding performance, forget it -NOT EVEN CURING CANCER MATTERS WHEN A RED ROOSTER FANBOI IS YAKKING ALONG THAT THEY HAVE NO BIAS.
Buddy, be angry, as you definitely deserve to be - where we got so many full of it liars is beyond me, but I suspect the 60's had something to do with it. Perhaps it's their tiny nvidia assaulted wallets - and that chip on their shoulder is just never going away.
I see someone mentioned Nvidia "tortured" the reviewers. LOL
hahahaahahahahahahaaa
There is no comparison... here's one they just hate:
The top ati core, without ddr5, and neutered for the lower tier, is the 4830.
The top nvd core, without ddr5, and neutered for the lower tier, is the 260/192.
Compare the 260/192 to the 4830 - and you'll see the absolute STOMPING it takes.
In fact go up to the 4850, no ddr5 - and it's STILL a kicking to proud of.
Now what would happen if NVidia put ddr5 on it's HATED G92 "rebrand" core ? LOL We both know - the 9800gtx+ and it's flavors actually competes equivalently with the 4850 - if Nvidia put ddr5 on it, it WOULD BE A 4870 .
Now, that G80/G92/G92b "all the same" according to the raging red roosters who SCREAM rebranded - is SEVERAL YEARS OLD nvidia technology... that - well - is the same quality as the current top core ati has produced.
So ATI is 2 years behind on core - luckily they had the one company that was making the dddr5 - to turn that 4850 into a 4870 - same core mind you!
So, the red roosters kept screaming for a GT200 "in the lower mid range" --- they kept whining nvidia has to do it - as if the 8800/9800 series wasn't there.
The real reason of course, would be - it could prove to them, deep down inside, that the GT200 "brute force" was really as bad or worse than the 770 core - bad enough that they could make something with it as lowly as the 4830...
Ahh, but it just hasn't happened - that's what the 2 year old plus rebrand of nvidia is for - competing with the ati core that doesn't have the ddr5 on it.
Well, this reality has been well covered up by the raging red rooster fanboys for quite some time. They are so enraged, and so deranged, and so filled with endless lies and fudging, that they just simply missed it - or drove it deep within their subconscoius, hoping they would never fully, conscoiusly realize it.
Well, that's what I'm here for ! :)
To spread the good word, the word of TRUTH.
josh6079 - Friday, April 3, 2009 - link
I just came from using Cat 9's to 182+'s when I upgraded to nVidia.The "efficiency when it comes to memory usage" is a non-issue -- especially on a "beefy pc."
The windows task manager is not a benchmark leading to conclusive comparisons regarding quality. My Nvidia GPU can (and has) occupied more memory, especially when I utilize nHancer so as to tap the super-sampling capabilities.
Also, it's something to note that nVidia's latest driver download is 77.0 MB in size, yet ATi's latest is only 38.2 MB.
papapapapapapapababy - Saturday, April 4, 2009 - link
1) Nhancer is just an optional utility, optional. IF want to check the gpu temps i just use gpuz, or everest, if i want to overclock i just use rivaturner, for the rest i have the nvidia control panel.The ccc, not only is a bloated crap, it also requires Ms NET framework, and spawns like 45 extra services running non stop ALL THE TIME, clogging my pc, and the thing dsnt even work! GREAT WORK ATI! CCC is stupidly slow and broken. Se, i dont need a massive mega all in one solution that doesn't work and runs like ass.
2) YOUR Nvidia GPU. YOUR. Thats the key word, here. Your fault. Just like that windows task manager of yours, it seems to me you just didnt know how to use that nvidia gpu . And you need that knowledge in order to form conclusive comparisons regarding efficiency.
3) i made a gif, just for you. here. try no to hurt yourself reading it.
http://i39.tinypic.com/5ygu91.jpg">http://i39.tinypic.com/5ygu91.jpg
3) upgrade your adsl? btw the nvidia driver includes the extra functionality, that ati dsnt even have. ( and hint, it doesn't pollute your pc!)
tamalero - Sunday, April 5, 2009 - link
sorry to bust your bubble, but your screenshots is no proof, its clear you removed a LOT OF PROCESSES just to take the screenshot, how about if you take the FULL desktop screenshot that shows the nvidia panel loaded?because it doesnt seem to be in the process list.
also you're liying, I got an ATI 3870. and I only got 3 processes of ATI, one of them being the "AI" tool for game optimizations(using the latest drivers).
and I agree with Anandtech for first time ever, PhysX is just not ready for the "big thing"
most of the things they bloat are just "tech demos" or very weak stuff, Mirrors Edge's PhysX in other hand does show indeed add a lot of graphical feel.
and funny you mention framework, because a lot of new games and programs NOW NEED the framework fundation, or at least the C++ redistribuitable groups.
also lately I've been reading a lot of fuzz related to the 275's optomizations, wich in many games forces games to use less AA levels than the chosen ones. and thus giving the "edge" to the 275 vs the 4890. (MSAA vs TRSS)
I suppose again NVidia as been playing the dirty way.
and its gets annoying how Nvidia as been doing that for quite a bit to keep the dumb thing of "opening a can of whoop ass"
papapapapapapapababy - Monday, April 6, 2009 - link
"you removed a LOT OF PROCESSES", dumbass... if its not a necessary service, its turned off REGARDLESS OF THE videocard . maybe you should try to do the same? (lol just 3 ati services, run the ccc and see) btw, if i CHOOSE to use the nvidia control panel, THEN a new nvidia service starts, THEN as soon as I CLOSE THE control panel ( the process disappears from the task manager. THAT 3 ATI SERVICES OF YOURS ARE RUNNING ALL THE FRINGIN TIME, DUMMY, Remaining resident in YOUR memory REGARDLESS IF YOU USE OR NOT THE CCC. AND THEY GET BIGGER, AND BIGGER, AND BIGGER. ALSO YOU HAVE TO USE THE NET CRAP. (EXTRA SERVICES!) AND FINALLY, THE CCC RUNS LIKE ASS. so there, i WIN. YOU LOOSE. END OF STORY.tamalero - Thursday, April 9, 2009 - link
hang on, since when you need the CCC panel to be ON ( Ie, loaded and not in the tray ) to play games?are you a bit dumb?
second, why you didnt filter out the services then?
your screenshot is bull
its almost like you ran WinXP in safe mode just to take the screenshot and claim your "memory superiority".
like I said, show us a full screen that shows the nvidia panel LOADED .
your argument is stupid .
4 Mb of Ram must be a LOT for you? (thats what my ATI driver uses currently on vista X64.. )
btw, theres also an option in ATI side to remove the panel from the tray.
the tray serves a similar function as ATI TOOL ( Ie, fast resolution , color dept and frecuency changes )
play apples with apples if you want to make a smart conversation.
"runs like ass", makes me wonder how old are you, 14 years old?
and my CC runs very fine, thank you!, not a single error.
also, I got all frameworks installed and even when programs loaded, I dont see any "framework" services running, nor application, so please, get your head out of your ass.
you're just like this pseudo SiliconDr who spreads only FUD and insults.
SiliconDoc - Friday, April 24, 2009 - link
Besides all your errors and the corrections issued, it comes down to you claiming " Don't load the software that came with the ATI card because it's a fat bloated pig thqt needs to be gotten rid of".Yes, and most people who want the performance have to do that.
Sad, isn't it ?
You do know you got spanked badly, and used pathetic 3rd grader whines like "~ your screencap is fake" after he had to correct you on it all....
Just keep it shut until you have a valid point - stop removing all doubt.